Talk:Episode 682
Long Summary I personally think that the longer and more detailed a long summary is, the better. I don't see any problem with Xil's writing style, or any incorrect information, so I don't see the point in removing a perfectly good edit. 21:03, February 15, 2015 (UTC) We are writing a resume, not a book neither a chronicle. No other page has such a long summary, so this is too long, otherwise all the others are to be re-written. And "the longer and more detailed a long summary is, the better" should mean that you must describe also all facial expressions and feelings, of all characters. We MUST limit to what is needed to understand what is happening. --Meganoide (talk) 21:20, February 16, 2015 (UTC) Forum:History Section Lengths. Just because you use a lot of words doesn't mean you are adding more content. Being over descriptive is not good because you draw away the attention from what you want to tell. In regards to the claim that no other page has this kind of length and detail of description: I wrote the long summaries for Episode 678 and Episode 680 in the same manner as I wrote the summary for this one, and since no one objected back then, I assumed that it was fine to write like that.--Xilinoc (talk) 01:52, February 17, 2015 (UTC) There are a LOT of pages written badly or that are unnecessary too long in this wiki in my opinion. I believe that's due the fact many editors update the pages therefore every detail is added one sentence at time. Somehow, this "overly descriptive" style became rather common and spread over the wiki. The point is that there are many ways to tell what's going on without leaving out any information. In the forum, I've addressed the issue and I also added some examples. Leviathan explained perfectly what I wasn't able to say. And the forum he linked received a lot of agreements, so why now people are against a reduction of this summary? I'm waiting 24 hours to let people understand, but then I'll cut down useless statements. --Meganoide (talk) 14:36, February 17, 2015 (UTC) That forum only applied to character articles. Besides that there's no such thing as a too long summary. SeaTerror (talk) 18:03, February 17, 2015 (UTC) Why didn't SeaTerror understand that only SERIOUS users' opinion was asked? Does any SERIOUS user want to tell something? Otherwise I'll continue my work of cropping text. --Meganoide (talk) 18:11, February 18, 2015 (UTC) Xil's writing style if fine. Let him keep doing what he's doing. Roranoa Drake II (talk) 18:54, February 18, 2015 (UTC) ^ Totally agree with ST and Drake. Xil's writing style is fine, and I have no problem with it at all. 23:22, February 18, 2015 (UTC) You're crazy, you don't understand that it must be a SUMMARY, not a description. --Meganoide (talk) 00:01, February 19, 2015 (UTC) Calling people crazy really won't solve the problem, just sayin. 00:03, February 19, 2015 (UTC) No such thing as a too long summary? What do you think the definition of "summary" is? I'll have to agree with Levi and Mega on this. It's not good to be overly descriptive. 01:04, February 19, 2015 (UTC) 5 vs 3. Poll it. SeaTerror (talk) 09:45, February 19, 2015 (UTC) Alright guys, I talked to Xil about what is exactly problematic with his writing style, like what y'all should have done in the first place, so we're not going to have this problem again later on. Now can we close this? 02:13, February 22, 2015 (UTC) Well, what's the decision on this one? Do keep the whole thing or use the trimmed version? 02:16, February 22, 2015 (UTC) I'd like to keep the whole thing, but I don't really care either way. 02:58, February 22, 2015 (UTC) I stand by my earlier statement: It's overly descriptive. Use the trimmed version Mega made. 03:02, February 22, 2015 (UTC) If I may...seeing as how I'm the one at fault here, I would suggest using the original version...trimmed by me, not by someone who has been ranting about me for over a week. That way, there can be consistency between this summary and any future summaries I write because the same person will be deciding what is worth cutting out. Sound good?--Xilinoc (talk) 03:36, February 22, 2015 (UTC) I'm fine with Xil's proposal to trim the summary himself. Any objection or what? 03:42, February 22, 2015 (UTC) I only object to him "needing" to trim it. It's fine how it is now. If he wants to trim it then that's fine too. SeaTerror (talk) 06:33, February 22, 2015 (UTC) No objection, I'm totally fine with Xil shortening the summary himself. 12:32, February 22, 2015 (UTC) I think it's absurd to allow only to Xilinoc to shorten the summary. This is a wiki and everyone can edit any page. If Xilinoc wants to learn how to write a no over-descriptive summary he can help other users who are working on his edit. --Meganoide (talk) 12:56, February 22, 2015 (UTC) Alright, so I've made an edit to the summary showing what changes I would make. I do agree with Levi that we should not normally write with this level of detail on history sections, etc. However, I have no problem with this level of detail on Episode summaries, as these pages won't get longer over time. However, there are some smaller changes I would make, Xilnoc: *You write really, really long sentences. Most of them are entirely separate ideas that you separate with "as", or "before". Be very careful when you use these words to make a transition. Sometimes you use these to even separate 3 separate ideas. Short sentences are your friend. *You only need transitional words like "Meanwhile" at the beginning of paragraphs. And your paragraphs should only be about one scene (unless it's a long one). An example of this is the paragraph where Koala is on the ship. I had to heavily edit that one. *You don't need to describe the reaction of every character to every other character's statements. Only do that when it is particularly relevant to the plot. *When describing conversations, please use different sentences for each character's line. *Keep descriptions of background characters such as random Marines, and the women at Senor's feet out of the summary. Those things aren't usually related to the larger plot, and are a needless addition to a summary. *Actions, like each part of Koala's fight scene, or Luffy & Co. changing directions as they run aren't needed. *Also, I didn't see any clear examples of this, but an important principle of encyclopedic writing is to write with the least amount of surprise possible. There's a term for this, but the basic idea is to write with the least suspense possible. We're an encyclopedia, not a suspense novel. So yeah, that's what I noted as I edited it. Sorry it took me over a week to get to this, but I've known I wanted to put a lot of work into this. This took me a couple hours to type out and edit. I hope this clears things up for the future. 17:16, February 22, 2015 (UTC) JSD's edits are good, let's go with those. 17:42, February 22, 2015 (UTC) Works for me, I can easily work within those guidelines in the future.--Xilinoc (talk) 18:37, February 22, 2015 (UTC) "However, I have no problem with this level of detail on Episode summaries" - I think you are missing the point of what I tried to say both here and in the forum. I think you guys are thinking that "more words" = "more details". That's not true. My objection was that this summary is the proverbial "wall of text", it's counter productive and most people don't even bother trying to read something like that. It can be easily avoidable without translating in indirect speech every dialog or describing what happens "on the camera" instead of "in the story". For example: :"Meanwhile, in the streets, the citizens of Dressrosa, armed with various weapons, hunt for the people whom Doflamingo placed bounties on. A Marine runs away from two citizens being controlled by Parasite, only to be saved by another Marine who binds the two men with a large chain. As the Marines escort several captured citizens away from the rest of the soldiers, Bastille asks Issho if they should be trying to capture Doflamingo, only for Issho to order him to tell all units to restrain as many rampaging people as possible and focus on the Straw Hat Pirates-Law alliance, shocking Bastille." I believe this paragraph describe what happens on the camera, but it doesn't focus on what happens. The key points are: # The citizens hunt the wanted people. # Issho orders the Marines to restrains rampaging people and to focus on the Straw Hat Pirates-Law alliance. Sentences like "X ask him that and when Y answers this X react this way wondering this" are just superfluous or unnecessary long for making a point. It's like comparing a match play-by-play, as it goes, commentary with its summary. You have to write what happens not what you see happening. I can make that paragraph twice as long without adding any new information, but would it be better if I did?